My recent FB posts & comments about USA President Trump's "go back" tweets & "send her back" rally chants; Will stop writing publicly on Trump's USA statements & policies
Given below are my recent Facebook posts and my comments on it, related to USA president Trump's tweets about "go back" and the "send her back" chants at his rally. This is followed by my post wondering whether I should stop writing publicly on Mr. Trump's statements & policies related to USA, followed by my decision to do so (stop writing publicly).
https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542529242630304 on 14th July 2019 (slightly edited)
Am making an exception in my policy of not commenting publicly about USA politics. I think there is some truth to Speaker Nancy Pelosi's view of this matter as expressed in this tweet response of hers to USA President Donald Trump's tweet: "When @realDonaldTrump tells four American Congresswomen to go back to their countries, he reaffirms his plan to “Make America Great Again” has always been about making America white again.
Our diversity is our strength and our unity is our power.", https://twitter.com/SpeakerPelosi/status/1150408691713265665, 14th July 2019
[Mr. Trump's tweet-set:
So interesting to see “Progressive” Democrat Congresswomen, who originally came from countries whose governments are a complete and total catastrophe, the worst, most corrupt and inept anywhere in the world (if they even have a functioning government at all), now loudly......
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381394234941448, 14th July 2019
....and viciously telling the people of the United States, the greatest and most powerful Nation on earth, how our government is to be run. Why don’t they go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came. Then come back and show us how....
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381395078000643
....it is done. These places need your help badly, you can’t leave fast enough. I’m sure that Nancy Pelosi would be very happy to quickly work out free travel arrangements!
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381396994723841]
Ravi: President Trump should not attack elected Democratic Party Congresswomen who are legal citizens of the USA, in this manner by suggesting to them to go back to the country from which they "originally came" and fix the governance problems there first. That's just not right in a democracy like USA. President Trump sure can attack the policies of these progressive Democratic congresswomen. That's fair and acceptable in a democracy. But the USA president suggesting to them to go back to the country they "originally came" from (country from where they or their parents migrated to USA) is downright scary and very worrying from a viewpoint of racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I agree with your view that USA Congress needs to censure President Donald Trump for these tweets of his with respect to democratically elected members of USA Congress. In the USA, Congress is a co-equal branch of government with the executive administration branch (Presidency), as I understand it.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542940359255859 on 15th July 2019
Very worrying and very sad to see the USA President use such words in public. I do not recall reading about any other USA president since the 1980s, whether Republican or Democrat, using such language against immigrants who are USA citizens and have been democratically elected to USA Congress.
From whatever little bit I know of Republican Presidents like Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush and George W. Bush (I am an Indian resident and citizen who has lived in the USA in the past for software development/consultancy assignment stints), I don't think they would have ever seriously contemplated using such language against immigrant-citizens of the USA who are members of USA Congress.
Democracy has to be protected and nurtured. It ****cannot**** be taken for granted, even in the USA!
I must add that President Trump has every right to be critical of the views and proposed policies of these Democratic Congresswomen. President Trump says that Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez was making up the story about some very disturbing allegations about treatment meted out to detainees at the southern USA border. I think President Trump has every right to challenge Ocasio-Cortez in this fashion. But what he should not do, is suggest to Congresswomen who are immigrants or second-generation immigrants to go back to the country they originally came from and fix the governance problems there. That is just not acceptable from a democratically elected leader of any country, even the USA, which is the most militarily powerful country on earth today.
Note that I am making an exception to my policy of not commenting publicly on USA politics.
[Shared article: Trump tells congresswomen to 'go back' to the 'crime infested places from which they came', https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/07/14/trump-tells-congresswomen-go-back-counties-they-came/1728253001/, 14th July 2019]
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2544281852455043, 16th July 2019
Since I have been publicly critical of USA President Trump's earlier tweets in this regard, I felt it appropriate to share this recent post of his where he says the tweets were not racist and that he does not have a racist bone in his body.
For me, it is not exactly an issue of racism. It is a matter of the impropriety of a democratic country's president telling elected members of Congress that they should go back to the country they originally came from and fix problems there first. That still is improper, in my considered view.
Regarding other comments of the Congresswomen that President Trump refers to in this post in a severely critical way, I don't know enough to comment. If any Congressman or Congresswoman has said anything that implies that they hate the USA, then, of course, there is a serious issue. But I really don't know enough about these Congresswomen and what they have said in the past, to have an opinion on this. In any case, if they have said something hateful about the USA, then that should be taken up by Congress and they should be held accountable (no need to tell them to go back to the country they originally came from).
That's my humble view for all its worth.
Prayers for peace and racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
[Contents of shared post of Donald J. Trump: Those Tweets were NOT Racist. I don’t have a Racist bone in my body! The so-called vote to be taken is a Democrat con game. Republicans should not show “weakness” and fall into their trap. This should be a vote on the filthy language, statements and lies told by the Democrat Congresswomen, who I truly believe, based on their actions, hate our Country. Get a list of the HORRIBLE things they have said. Omar is polling at 8%, Cortez at 21%. Nancy Pelosi tried to push them away, but now they are forever wedded to the Democrat Party. See you in 2020!]
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545584358991459, 18th July 2019
USA 2020 election season may be as rough as 2016. I am shocked to hear the "send her back" chant in a rally of President Trump! Hmm. But that seems to be the reality on the ground for the 2020 Presidential campaign season.
Crowd chants 'send her back' as Trump escalates attacks on Ilhan Omar and 'The Squad', https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/17/politics/donald-trump-greenville-rally/index.html
Ravi: "Send her back"! Back where? Back to Somalia where she was born? She is a naturalized citizen of the USA. The CNN report states, 'As the President castigated Minnesota Rep. Ilhan Omar with a litany of accusations, the crowd chanted, "Send her back!" Trump made no effort to stop the chant, pausing during his remarks as the chant grew louder.'
I think it is very disappointing that President Trump did not publicly object to the "send her back" chants. I should also make clear that I am not saying anything about or objecting to President Trump's accusations against Congresswoman Omar. I don't know enough to comment and neither do I want to get involved in commenting about such matters.
I wonder now, how the supporters of President Trump will use these "send her back" chants. Will it be limited to just President Trump's rallies? Will it be limited only to targeting Congresswoman Ilhan Omar and the other Congresswomen of "The Squad"? We will have to wait and see.
Sad to see USA society get into such polarization which is being fueled by campaign rallies of the President. I think the right thing for President Trump to do, is to publicly ask his supporters not to use the "send her back" chants.
Please note that I am not promoting/supporting any political party in the USA (Republican or Democrat). Of course, as I am an Indian citizen living in India, there is no question of me having voted in USA elections. I am a well-wisher of the people of the USA.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545599055656656, 18th July 2019
Interesting article reportedly having 1905 letter from USA President's grandfather Friedrich Trump to the then prince regent of Bavaria (part of modern Germany), requesting that his deportation order from Bavaria (where he was born) be withdrawn.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-grandfather-germany-letter-deportation-us-bavaria-dreamers-a7903071.html, 20th Aug. 2017
As per his letter, Friedrich Trump had emigrated to USA in 1885, settled down in USA (New York), becoming rich from his work, and becoming an American citizen in 1892. Around 1902, due to his wife not being able to tolerate the climate in New York (as per his letter), he and his family moved back to Bavaria.
The article states that German authorities denied him repatriation as he had not completed the mandatory military service and he had not registered his emigration to USA in 1885.
The letter is interesting not only from the context of emigration and repatriation, but also as a peek into how life was in continental Europe in 1905! Bavaria was a Christian kingdom! The letter appeals to His Royal Highness for help!
How life has changed in just one century after that! Democracy is an awesome thing with courts of justice that uphold rights of citizens! And the Internet today provides an awesome communication platform which can be used to uphold democracy and courts of justice.
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The Trump Family's Immigrant Story, https://www.history.com/news/donald-trump-father-mother-ancestry.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2546104485606113, 19th July 2019
In the initial part of this video, USA President Trump says that he disagrees with the "send her back" chant. He then says, "I was not happy with it".
I am very happy to hear these words from President Trump. Hopefully, we will not see such "send her back" chants in future rallies of his, at least at noticeable levels.
Good to see this. My prayers for racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
[Shared video link: https://www.facebook.com/DonaldTrump/videos/727143797688993/]
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In response to a comment, I wrote: Well, political leaders can sometimes be not so clear in such matters. "Constructive ambiguity" is the relatively new phrase I have learned from following the Brexit issue to some extent.
The main thing is that he said the words which I have quoted in the post above. I am happy with that.
You may want him to do more. I respect your view.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: You seriously think that most politicians speak the truth, the full truth and nothing but the truth? If so, then I think we live in different worlds.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - Noted that you found it disturbing. For me, the words of top leaders of countries matter. They have the power to declare trade wars, and even real wars. Their words matter, as far as I am concerned.
If Mr. Trump had not said these words then it would have been worse than it is now, in my view. I don't know how you think about that. Would you have preferred that Mr. Trump said that he liked the "send her back" chant?
Regarding Congresswoman Omar, I don't know much about her views and don't want to get involved in that matter.
Mr. Trump is President and so his words are important.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I think our argument can become endless. Let us stop here. I am glad that Mr. Trump has de-escalated the situation and I do hope that in future we will not see a repeat of this dangerous chant. You don't seem to be happy about it. Fine. Let's just leave it there.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: I have said what I wanted to say. Thanks.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - Please show me where I have said all politicians and leaders should be believed.
BTW I notice that you seem to like to go after me for such posts but you stay silent on posts where I am critical of Trump like my earlier posts on this matter. I find that to be rather strange behaviour.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: What you have quoted of my words are: "For me, the words of top leaders of countries matter". That is different from believing a politician's words. I hope you understand the difference.
President Trump's words matter, whether they are the truth or not. He is the commander-in-chief of the most powerful military forces ever seen.
What you don't seem to understand is that if President Trump had not said that he disagrees with the "send her back" chant, the situation could have become worse in the USA. White nationalists are a dangerous group of people with some of them being armed to the teeth.
I think you simply are not able to understand how top leaders' words matter, irrespective of whether they are true or not. That's the power of the position. It is a mega megaphone that they have.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I have noted your outright condemnation of Mr. Trump. You have moved to topics far beyond what I have posted on which is the "send her back" disavowal words that Mr. Trump said.
I do not want to publicly comment on the topics you have raised as that I feel is appropriate for me given one of my roles as social media writer on spirituality & religion. Some others who write on spirituality & religion are politically aligned and active as well and so do comment on these matters. I am NOT politically aligned or active.
I think it may be best for me not to comment on this post anymore. All the best! Prayers for peace and harmony in the USA. [I disagree with you on "NOT a time for "civility", "thoughts-and-prayers"". But that's fine. We can agree to disagree. In my view, prayers can be said anytime.]
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I wrote: I think it will be best for no more comments on politics to be made on this post as the discussion is veering off topic and into larger political areas. I request that no further comments about politics be made on this post.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2547363585480203, 20th July 2019
Am wondering whether I should stop putting up posts that are critical of Mr. Trump when he gets into dangerous for social harmony territory like the "send her back" issue
Recently I went through some behaviour that I found to be strange. When I put up these two posts critical of Mr. Trump as I felt he was getting into dangerous for social harmony territory like the "send her back" issue (USA 2020 election season may be as rough as 2016. ... https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545584358991459 & Very worrying and very sad to see the USA President use such words in public. ... https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542940359255859), a couple or so people liked each of the posts. I was happy to see that. It takes courage for a non-American citizen (I am an Indian citizen and an Indian resident) to ***publicly*** be critical of Mr. Trump who is the most powerful man on earth today as the commander-in-chief of the most powerful armed forces ever seen on earth. But I felt the urge to do so, in the interests of larger social good with a tiny, tiny contribution through my tiny, tiny voice on social media expressing itself ***publicly***.
Then when Mr. Trump disavowed the "send her back" chant, I felt a great sense of relief. So I wrote a post saying that I am very happy that he has disavowed the chant, https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2546104485606113. On that post, I faced a lot of criticism from a couple of people. Note that these persons had not liked or commented on my earlier posts where I was critical of Mr. Trump.
I think they were very upset that I ***publicly*** said that I was very happy to hear those words from Mr. Trump. There were some back-and-forth comments on the post. But I think the core issue is that these persons seem to be very upset with any post that appreciates anything that Mr. Trump does.
I continue to be convinced that what I wrote is appropriate. Those who were critical of my above mentioned post are surely entitled to their views. We just have to agree to disagree.
But now I am wondering whether it is worth it to write any public posts related to Mr. Trump, which includes posts critical of him when he veers off into territory that might impact social harmony in the USA. I mean, does my writing these posts help or hurt. I am not willing to only write posts critical of Mr. Trump which is what some FB folks would like. I would like to be fair and give credit where I think it is due. But anything that I say where I am appreciative of something about Mr. Trump, attracts rage from some FB folks in my circle!
Perhaps I should simply join the vast majority in my Facebook circle of friends and followers, and stay silent on whatever Mr. Trump does or says, even if it may impact social harmony in the USA.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I wanted to stop commenting on that particular post. This is a more general post about whether I should comment in future about Mr. Trump at all. So far you are the only person who has commented. Nobody has liked the post or responded to it in any other way either.
I think the general view I am forming is that it is best that I should publicly not say anything at all about Mr. Trump with respect to USA. Let him do what he wants in the USA - I mean, in the sense that I need not bother about it. Of course, Mr. Trump will have to face those that are opposed to him & his policies.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): Sure --name-snipped-- - You certainly have your rights to speak up against him. All the best to you for your writings & activism in this regard.
I simply need not get involved. That's what I am saying, given the lack of interest that people have shown about this post of mine. I can use my time for other things.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): My God! --Name-snipped-- Insulting! If you feel so insulted by my comments and posts related to President Trump, perhaps it may be best for us to not be Facebook friends.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: You said you felt insulted. So my words are hurting you. I think it is best then that you stop seeing my words. That way you don't get insulted. I wish you well.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - If you too feel insulted by my comments and posts related to President Trump, I think it may be best for us to not be Facebook friends.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: I think there is just too much distance between our views for us to have a useful conversation. So I honestly feel it will be best for us to not interact anymore. So unfriending will stop the interaction. Good for you and good for me!
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): OK --Name-snipped--. I wish you well. I will be unfriending you now. I think that is best for both you and me. Thanks.
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I wrote: Just did the unfriending! All the best to you. Thanks.
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I wrote (slightly edited): I just unfriended --Name-snipped--. I think it best that I unfriend you too. I wish you well. Thanks for all the interactions we had.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - People are free to be critical of Mr. Trump. The big problem I had was the horrific level of what I see as intolerance to my relief at Mr. Trump saying that he was not supportive of the "send her back" chant.
Now whether he means what he says or not is different. The fact that he said so, in my view, lessened the tension. I was happy about that.
Now others may not be happy with Trump having said so - fine. They may think that Trump does not mean it and is playing a game - fine. But I have a right to hold my view that I am happy that Trump said he was not supportive of the "send her back" chant. And if me holding that view is insulting to some people, I think it is best that such people don't read my posts & comments. And the best way to achieve that is to unfriend. As simple as that.
Further, it is my considered opinion that such intolerance of my post is not good for democracy. You can disagree but you need not verbally attack anybody who feels some relief at Mr. Trump having stepped back from some harsh words.
In my view, this is like, if you say anything positive about Mr. Trump then you are a horrible, terrible bad guy. And that whenever you take the name of Mr. Trump you should say that he is a terrible, terrible guy.
Well, he is the President of the USA. That position carries weight. I recognize that. So I, for sure, will exercise my fair right to be appreciative of some things of Mr. Trump, as POTUS. And it is best that those people who simply cannot stand me saying such words, don't see my comments & posts.
As of now, I have decided not to comment on Mr. Trump's policies and statements in context of USA internal affairs - as I find that it seems to cause more hurt than helping anybody. But I sure will comment on his policies and statements on the international (non USA) stage. And, I repeat, if I am happy with some thing that he does on that stage, like meeting Kim Jong Un in South Korea instead of threatening to destroy North Korea, I will surely say so ***publicly***. Those that cannot stand such statements of mine, can simply unfriend me and thereby avoid the unpleasantness of having to see such statements.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): Thank you for your valuable view --Name-snipped-- sir!
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2547627805453781, 20th July 2019
In a Facebook exchange I had elsewhere, a reference to 1898 Wilmington white supremacy was made. I had not known about it and so read up the wiki page on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilmington_insurrection_of_1898.
This is in North Carolina, USA. 1898 is not too far back and a few decades after the American Civil War was supposed to have settled the issue about rights of the African-American being equal to that of the white man. Reading it was very, very disturbing! The language used by politicians of that time to incite some of the white folks against African-Americans ***and the white folks who supported the rights of African-Americans***, is horrifying. Hmm. [The white folks who supported the rights of African-Americans were termed by the racist white politicians as race-traitors!]
The USA has a very violent history. No wonder, right to own a gun is so sensitive an issue in USA. It is the gun that made the difference in the white supremacists of Wilmington winning in 1898. African-Americans who wanted to protect themselves in the expected violence were typically not allowed to buy guns!
The group that had the guns totally dominated the group that did not have guns!
I think all good people in the USA must be alert and not allow the horrible white supremacist ideology that won in Wilmington, North Carolina in 1898, to come to the fore in USA today.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542529242630304 on 14th July 2019 (slightly edited)
Am making an exception in my policy of not commenting publicly about USA politics. I think there is some truth to Speaker Nancy Pelosi's view of this matter as expressed in this tweet response of hers to USA President Donald Trump's tweet: "When @realDonaldTrump tells four American Congresswomen to go back to their countries, he reaffirms his plan to “Make America Great Again” has always been about making America white again.
Our diversity is our strength and our unity is our power.", https://twitter.com/SpeakerPelosi/status/1150408691713265665, 14th July 2019
[Mr. Trump's tweet-set:
So interesting to see “Progressive” Democrat Congresswomen, who originally came from countries whose governments are a complete and total catastrophe, the worst, most corrupt and inept anywhere in the world (if they even have a functioning government at all), now loudly......
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381394234941448, 14th July 2019
....and viciously telling the people of the United States, the greatest and most powerful Nation on earth, how our government is to be run. Why don’t they go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came. Then come back and show us how....
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381395078000643
....it is done. These places need your help badly, you can’t leave fast enough. I’m sure that Nancy Pelosi would be very happy to quickly work out free travel arrangements!
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1150381396994723841]
Ravi: President Trump should not attack elected Democratic Party Congresswomen who are legal citizens of the USA, in this manner by suggesting to them to go back to the country from which they "originally came" and fix the governance problems there first. That's just not right in a democracy like USA. President Trump sure can attack the policies of these progressive Democratic congresswomen. That's fair and acceptable in a democracy. But the USA president suggesting to them to go back to the country they "originally came" from (country from where they or their parents migrated to USA) is downright scary and very worrying from a viewpoint of racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I agree with your view that USA Congress needs to censure President Donald Trump for these tweets of his with respect to democratically elected members of USA Congress. In the USA, Congress is a co-equal branch of government with the executive administration branch (Presidency), as I understand it.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542940359255859 on 15th July 2019
Very worrying and very sad to see the USA President use such words in public. I do not recall reading about any other USA president since the 1980s, whether Republican or Democrat, using such language against immigrants who are USA citizens and have been democratically elected to USA Congress.
From whatever little bit I know of Republican Presidents like Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush and George W. Bush (I am an Indian resident and citizen who has lived in the USA in the past for software development/consultancy assignment stints), I don't think they would have ever seriously contemplated using such language against immigrant-citizens of the USA who are members of USA Congress.
Democracy has to be protected and nurtured. It ****cannot**** be taken for granted, even in the USA!
I must add that President Trump has every right to be critical of the views and proposed policies of these Democratic Congresswomen. President Trump says that Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez was making up the story about some very disturbing allegations about treatment meted out to detainees at the southern USA border. I think President Trump has every right to challenge Ocasio-Cortez in this fashion. But what he should not do, is suggest to Congresswomen who are immigrants or second-generation immigrants to go back to the country they originally came from and fix the governance problems there. That is just not acceptable from a democratically elected leader of any country, even the USA, which is the most militarily powerful country on earth today.
Note that I am making an exception to my policy of not commenting publicly on USA politics.
[Shared article: Trump tells congresswomen to 'go back' to the 'crime infested places from which they came', https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/07/14/trump-tells-congresswomen-go-back-counties-they-came/1728253001/, 14th July 2019]
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2544281852455043, 16th July 2019
Since I have been publicly critical of USA President Trump's earlier tweets in this regard, I felt it appropriate to share this recent post of his where he says the tweets were not racist and that he does not have a racist bone in his body.
For me, it is not exactly an issue of racism. It is a matter of the impropriety of a democratic country's president telling elected members of Congress that they should go back to the country they originally came from and fix problems there first. That still is improper, in my considered view.
Regarding other comments of the Congresswomen that President Trump refers to in this post in a severely critical way, I don't know enough to comment. If any Congressman or Congresswoman has said anything that implies that they hate the USA, then, of course, there is a serious issue. But I really don't know enough about these Congresswomen and what they have said in the past, to have an opinion on this. In any case, if they have said something hateful about the USA, then that should be taken up by Congress and they should be held accountable (no need to tell them to go back to the country they originally came from).
That's my humble view for all its worth.
Prayers for peace and racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
[Contents of shared post of Donald J. Trump: Those Tweets were NOT Racist. I don’t have a Racist bone in my body! The so-called vote to be taken is a Democrat con game. Republicans should not show “weakness” and fall into their trap. This should be a vote on the filthy language, statements and lies told by the Democrat Congresswomen, who I truly believe, based on their actions, hate our Country. Get a list of the HORRIBLE things they have said. Omar is polling at 8%, Cortez at 21%. Nancy Pelosi tried to push them away, but now they are forever wedded to the Democrat Party. See you in 2020!]
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545584358991459, 18th July 2019
USA 2020 election season may be as rough as 2016. I am shocked to hear the "send her back" chant in a rally of President Trump! Hmm. But that seems to be the reality on the ground for the 2020 Presidential campaign season.
Crowd chants 'send her back' as Trump escalates attacks on Ilhan Omar and 'The Squad', https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/17/politics/donald-trump-greenville-rally/index.html
Ravi: "Send her back"! Back where? Back to Somalia where she was born? She is a naturalized citizen of the USA. The CNN report states, 'As the President castigated Minnesota Rep. Ilhan Omar with a litany of accusations, the crowd chanted, "Send her back!" Trump made no effort to stop the chant, pausing during his remarks as the chant grew louder.'
I think it is very disappointing that President Trump did not publicly object to the "send her back" chants. I should also make clear that I am not saying anything about or objecting to President Trump's accusations against Congresswoman Omar. I don't know enough to comment and neither do I want to get involved in commenting about such matters.
I wonder now, how the supporters of President Trump will use these "send her back" chants. Will it be limited to just President Trump's rallies? Will it be limited only to targeting Congresswoman Ilhan Omar and the other Congresswomen of "The Squad"? We will have to wait and see.
Sad to see USA society get into such polarization which is being fueled by campaign rallies of the President. I think the right thing for President Trump to do, is to publicly ask his supporters not to use the "send her back" chants.
Please note that I am not promoting/supporting any political party in the USA (Republican or Democrat). Of course, as I am an Indian citizen living in India, there is no question of me having voted in USA elections. I am a well-wisher of the people of the USA.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545599055656656, 18th July 2019
Interesting article reportedly having 1905 letter from USA President's grandfather Friedrich Trump to the then prince regent of Bavaria (part of modern Germany), requesting that his deportation order from Bavaria (where he was born) be withdrawn.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-grandfather-germany-letter-deportation-us-bavaria-dreamers-a7903071.html, 20th Aug. 2017
As per his letter, Friedrich Trump had emigrated to USA in 1885, settled down in USA (New York), becoming rich from his work, and becoming an American citizen in 1892. Around 1902, due to his wife not being able to tolerate the climate in New York (as per his letter), he and his family moved back to Bavaria.
The article states that German authorities denied him repatriation as he had not completed the mandatory military service and he had not registered his emigration to USA in 1885.
The letter is interesting not only from the context of emigration and repatriation, but also as a peek into how life was in continental Europe in 1905! Bavaria was a Christian kingdom! The letter appeals to His Royal Highness for help!
How life has changed in just one century after that! Democracy is an awesome thing with courts of justice that uphold rights of citizens! And the Internet today provides an awesome communication platform which can be used to uphold democracy and courts of justice.
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The Trump Family's Immigrant Story, https://www.history.com/news/donald-trump-father-mother-ancestry.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2546104485606113, 19th July 2019
In the initial part of this video, USA President Trump says that he disagrees with the "send her back" chant. He then says, "I was not happy with it".
I am very happy to hear these words from President Trump. Hopefully, we will not see such "send her back" chants in future rallies of his, at least at noticeable levels.
Good to see this. My prayers for racial, ethnic and religious harmony in the USA.
[Shared video link: https://www.facebook.com/DonaldTrump/videos/727143797688993/]
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In response to a comment, I wrote: Well, political leaders can sometimes be not so clear in such matters. "Constructive ambiguity" is the relatively new phrase I have learned from following the Brexit issue to some extent.
The main thing is that he said the words which I have quoted in the post above. I am happy with that.
You may want him to do more. I respect your view.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: You seriously think that most politicians speak the truth, the full truth and nothing but the truth? If so, then I think we live in different worlds.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - Noted that you found it disturbing. For me, the words of top leaders of countries matter. They have the power to declare trade wars, and even real wars. Their words matter, as far as I am concerned.
If Mr. Trump had not said these words then it would have been worse than it is now, in my view. I don't know how you think about that. Would you have preferred that Mr. Trump said that he liked the "send her back" chant?
Regarding Congresswoman Omar, I don't know much about her views and don't want to get involved in that matter.
Mr. Trump is President and so his words are important.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I think our argument can become endless. Let us stop here. I am glad that Mr. Trump has de-escalated the situation and I do hope that in future we will not see a repeat of this dangerous chant. You don't seem to be happy about it. Fine. Let's just leave it there.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: I have said what I wanted to say. Thanks.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - Please show me where I have said all politicians and leaders should be believed.
BTW I notice that you seem to like to go after me for such posts but you stay silent on posts where I am critical of Trump like my earlier posts on this matter. I find that to be rather strange behaviour.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: What you have quoted of my words are: "For me, the words of top leaders of countries matter". That is different from believing a politician's words. I hope you understand the difference.
President Trump's words matter, whether they are the truth or not. He is the commander-in-chief of the most powerful military forces ever seen.
What you don't seem to understand is that if President Trump had not said that he disagrees with the "send her back" chant, the situation could have become worse in the USA. White nationalists are a dangerous group of people with some of them being armed to the teeth.
I think you simply are not able to understand how top leaders' words matter, irrespective of whether they are true or not. That's the power of the position. It is a mega megaphone that they have.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I have noted your outright condemnation of Mr. Trump. You have moved to topics far beyond what I have posted on which is the "send her back" disavowal words that Mr. Trump said.
I do not want to publicly comment on the topics you have raised as that I feel is appropriate for me given one of my roles as social media writer on spirituality & religion. Some others who write on spirituality & religion are politically aligned and active as well and so do comment on these matters. I am NOT politically aligned or active.
I think it may be best for me not to comment on this post anymore. All the best! Prayers for peace and harmony in the USA. [I disagree with you on "NOT a time for "civility", "thoughts-and-prayers"". But that's fine. We can agree to disagree. In my view, prayers can be said anytime.]
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I wrote: I think it will be best for no more comments on politics to be made on this post as the discussion is veering off topic and into larger political areas. I request that no further comments about politics be made on this post.
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2547363585480203, 20th July 2019
Am wondering whether I should stop putting up posts that are critical of Mr. Trump when he gets into dangerous for social harmony territory like the "send her back" issue
Recently I went through some behaviour that I found to be strange. When I put up these two posts critical of Mr. Trump as I felt he was getting into dangerous for social harmony territory like the "send her back" issue (USA 2020 election season may be as rough as 2016. ... https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2545584358991459 & Very worrying and very sad to see the USA President use such words in public. ... https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2542940359255859), a couple or so people liked each of the posts. I was happy to see that. It takes courage for a non-American citizen (I am an Indian citizen and an Indian resident) to ***publicly*** be critical of Mr. Trump who is the most powerful man on earth today as the commander-in-chief of the most powerful armed forces ever seen on earth. But I felt the urge to do so, in the interests of larger social good with a tiny, tiny contribution through my tiny, tiny voice on social media expressing itself ***publicly***.
Then when Mr. Trump disavowed the "send her back" chant, I felt a great sense of relief. So I wrote a post saying that I am very happy that he has disavowed the chant, https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2546104485606113. On that post, I faced a lot of criticism from a couple of people. Note that these persons had not liked or commented on my earlier posts where I was critical of Mr. Trump.
I think they were very upset that I ***publicly*** said that I was very happy to hear those words from Mr. Trump. There were some back-and-forth comments on the post. But I think the core issue is that these persons seem to be very upset with any post that appreciates anything that Mr. Trump does.
I continue to be convinced that what I wrote is appropriate. Those who were critical of my above mentioned post are surely entitled to their views. We just have to agree to disagree.
But now I am wondering whether it is worth it to write any public posts related to Mr. Trump, which includes posts critical of him when he veers off into territory that might impact social harmony in the USA. I mean, does my writing these posts help or hurt. I am not willing to only write posts critical of Mr. Trump which is what some FB folks would like. I would like to be fair and give credit where I think it is due. But anything that I say where I am appreciative of something about Mr. Trump, attracts rage from some FB folks in my circle!
Perhaps I should simply join the vast majority in my Facebook circle of friends and followers, and stay silent on whatever Mr. Trump does or says, even if it may impact social harmony in the USA.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - I wanted to stop commenting on that particular post. This is a more general post about whether I should comment in future about Mr. Trump at all. So far you are the only person who has commented. Nobody has liked the post or responded to it in any other way either.
I think the general view I am forming is that it is best that I should publicly not say anything at all about Mr. Trump with respect to USA. Let him do what he wants in the USA - I mean, in the sense that I need not bother about it. Of course, Mr. Trump will have to face those that are opposed to him & his policies.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): Sure --name-snipped-- - You certainly have your rights to speak up against him. All the best to you for your writings & activism in this regard.
I simply need not get involved. That's what I am saying, given the lack of interest that people have shown about this post of mine. I can use my time for other things.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): My God! --Name-snipped-- Insulting! If you feel so insulted by my comments and posts related to President Trump, perhaps it may be best for us to not be Facebook friends.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: You said you felt insulted. So my words are hurting you. I think it is best then that you stop seeing my words. That way you don't get insulted. I wish you well.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - If you too feel insulted by my comments and posts related to President Trump, I think it may be best for us to not be Facebook friends.
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In response to a comment, I wrote: I think there is just too much distance between our views for us to have a useful conversation. So I honestly feel it will be best for us to not interact anymore. So unfriending will stop the interaction. Good for you and good for me!
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): OK --Name-snipped--. I wish you well. I will be unfriending you now. I think that is best for both you and me. Thanks.
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I wrote: Just did the unfriending! All the best to you. Thanks.
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I wrote (slightly edited): I just unfriended --Name-snipped--. I think it best that I unfriend you too. I wish you well. Thanks for all the interactions we had.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): --Name-snipped-- - People are free to be critical of Mr. Trump. The big problem I had was the horrific level of what I see as intolerance to my relief at Mr. Trump saying that he was not supportive of the "send her back" chant.
Now whether he means what he says or not is different. The fact that he said so, in my view, lessened the tension. I was happy about that.
Now others may not be happy with Trump having said so - fine. They may think that Trump does not mean it and is playing a game - fine. But I have a right to hold my view that I am happy that Trump said he was not supportive of the "send her back" chant. And if me holding that view is insulting to some people, I think it is best that such people don't read my posts & comments. And the best way to achieve that is to unfriend. As simple as that.
Further, it is my considered opinion that such intolerance of my post is not good for democracy. You can disagree but you need not verbally attack anybody who feels some relief at Mr. Trump having stepped back from some harsh words.
In my view, this is like, if you say anything positive about Mr. Trump then you are a horrible, terrible bad guy. And that whenever you take the name of Mr. Trump you should say that he is a terrible, terrible guy.
Well, he is the President of the USA. That position carries weight. I recognize that. So I, for sure, will exercise my fair right to be appreciative of some things of Mr. Trump, as POTUS. And it is best that those people who simply cannot stand me saying such words, don't see my comments & posts.
As of now, I have decided not to comment on Mr. Trump's policies and statements in context of USA internal affairs - as I find that it seems to cause more hurt than helping anybody. But I sure will comment on his policies and statements on the international (non USA) stage. And, I repeat, if I am happy with some thing that he does on that stage, like meeting Kim Jong Un in South Korea instead of threatening to destroy North Korea, I will surely say so ***publicly***. Those that cannot stand such statements of mine, can simply unfriend me and thereby avoid the unpleasantness of having to see such statements.
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In response to a comment, I wrote (slightly edited): Thank you for your valuable view --Name-snipped-- sir!
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https://www.facebook.com/ravi.s.iyer.7/posts/2547627805453781, 20th July 2019
In a Facebook exchange I had elsewhere, a reference to 1898 Wilmington white supremacy was made. I had not known about it and so read up the wiki page on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilmington_insurrection_of_1898.
This is in North Carolina, USA. 1898 is not too far back and a few decades after the American Civil War was supposed to have settled the issue about rights of the African-American being equal to that of the white man. Reading it was very, very disturbing! The language used by politicians of that time to incite some of the white folks against African-Americans ***and the white folks who supported the rights of African-Americans***, is horrifying. Hmm. [The white folks who supported the rights of African-Americans were termed by the racist white politicians as race-traitors!]
The USA has a very violent history. No wonder, right to own a gun is so sensitive an issue in USA. It is the gun that made the difference in the white supremacists of Wilmington winning in 1898. African-Americans who wanted to protect themselves in the expected violence were typically not allowed to buy guns!
The group that had the guns totally dominated the group that did not have guns!
I think all good people in the USA must be alert and not allow the horrible white supremacist ideology that won in Wilmington, North Carolina in 1898, to come to the fore in USA today.
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